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	<title>Comments on: Superstitious behavior: Animals have it, too</title>
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	<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/</link>
	<description>The Web blog of the Pet Connection, a pet-care feature syndicated internationally by Universal Press.</description>
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		<title>By: The OTHER Pat</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-468708</link>
		<dc:creator>The OTHER Pat</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 20:19:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-468708</guid>
		<description>From Liz&#039;s article:  &quot;Superstitious behavior is often defined as behavior that the animal offers &lt;b&gt;that is unrelated to&lt;/b&gt; the behavior being performed or trained, or unrelated to another action.&quot; (emphasis mine)

This is the critical detail that a lot of the posters on this thread have overlooked.  The lack of relationship - or &quot;cause and effect&quot; - between the behavior and some other event despite the fact that the animal subsequently appears to have ascribed a &quot;cause and effect&quot; relationship.  Thus, Liz&#039;s dog somehow coming to the conclusion that it was necessary for him to be around the corner if he wanted to be called back into the house even though there was no causal relationship between the two qualifies as &quot;superstitious behavior&quot;.  While - as pointed out by H. Houlahan -the behavior of Foxhound Jake who has learned he can *cause* his owners to give him attention if he makes a lot of racket does not.

The deer who remained behind a fence which was no longer there were exhibiting a behavior which had a direct cause - the fence.  It caused it to be impossible for them to cross to the other side of their enclosure and they retained this &quot;learning&quot; even after the fence was removed.

The fact that new deer also stayed to one side of the previously-fenced enclosure was simply an expression of herd behavior.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From Liz&#8217;s article:  &#8220;Superstitious behavior is often defined as behavior that the animal offers <b>that is unrelated to</b> the behavior being performed or trained, or unrelated to another action.&#8221; (emphasis mine)</p>
<p>This is the critical detail that a lot of the posters on this thread have overlooked.  The lack of relationship - or &#8220;cause and effect&#8221; - between the behavior and some other event despite the fact that the animal subsequently appears to have ascribed a &#8220;cause and effect&#8221; relationship.  Thus, Liz&#8217;s dog somehow coming to the conclusion that it was necessary for him to be around the corner if he wanted to be called back into the house even though there was no causal relationship between the two qualifies as &#8220;superstitious behavior&#8221;.  While - as pointed out by H. Houlahan -the behavior of Foxhound Jake who has learned he can *cause* his owners to give him attention if he makes a lot of racket does not.</p>
<p>The deer who remained behind a fence which was no longer there were exhibiting a behavior which had a direct cause - the fence.  It caused it to be impossible for them to cross to the other side of their enclosure and they retained this &#8220;learning&#8221; even after the fence was removed.</p>
<p>The fact that new deer also stayed to one side of the previously-fenced enclosure was simply an expression of herd behavior.</p>
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		<title>By: Avadhesh Malik</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-468573</link>
		<dc:creator>Avadhesh Malik</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 11 Jul 2009 11:21:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-468573</guid>
		<description>....well, i&#039;ll rather not term it as &quot;superstition&quot;........instead, it&#039;s a form of behavioral change known as &quot;acquired instinct&quot;..
..for example, in a Russian zoo, one half of deer enclosure was fenced away (visible fencing in this case)....and after some time, the deer, especially those who were brought up in the half enclosure, didn&#039;t even try to get to the other side -- even after the fence was removed......

....interesting reading though..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;.well, i&#8217;ll rather not term it as &#8220;superstition&#8221;&#8230;&#8230;..instead, it&#8217;s a form of behavioral change known as &#8220;acquired instinct&#8221;..<br />
..for example, in a Russian zoo, one half of deer enclosure was fenced away (visible fencing in this case)&#8230;.and after some time, the deer, especially those who were brought up in the half enclosure, didn&#8217;t even try to get to the other side &#8212; even after the fence was removed&#8230;&#8230;</p>
<p>&#8230;.interesting reading though..</p>
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		<title>By: Moira</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-466407</link>
		<dc:creator>Moira</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 20:36:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-466407</guid>
		<description>Shauna, install the child-proof safety latches on the cabinet doors and drawers also the door knobs that lead to outside if she has learned to open those.  Cats learn quickly what gets them attention or treats thus stopping the behavior can be a difficult task.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Shauna, install the child-proof safety latches on the cabinet doors and drawers also the door knobs that lead to outside if she has learned to open those.  Cats learn quickly what gets them attention or treats thus stopping the behavior can be a difficult task.</p>
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		<title>By: Mary</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-466396</link>
		<dc:creator>Mary</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 20:06:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-466396</guid>
		<description>Bashire&#039;s behavior as you describe may be superstitious - but it would also make me wonder if he is afraid of one or both of the other two dogs.  Entryways are places where violent territorial or dominance disputes can occur suddenly between dogs; their communication is very subtle beforehand.  Could Bashire be staying back from the dogs in the doorway out of fear?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bashire&#8217;s behavior as you describe may be superstitious - but it would also make me wonder if he is afraid of one or both of the other two dogs.  Entryways are places where violent territorial or dominance disputes can occur suddenly between dogs; their communication is very subtle beforehand.  Could Bashire be staying back from the dogs in the doorway out of fear?</p>
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		<title>By: Sarah K Andrew</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-466383</link>
		<dc:creator>Sarah K Andrew</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 19:35:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-466383</guid>
		<description>I knew a horse who always backed into his stall for meals. 

His paddock was connected to his stall and he could come and go as he pleased. You could put a halter on him and lead him in his stall, but if he was loose and it was feeding time, he ALWAYS came into the stall in reverse. I worked at the barn for several years and had the chance to observe it hundreds of times. 

My only guess is that it has something to do with some despooking training he received as a youngster. He was an abnormally spooky horse, so his owners put lots of bright and &quot;looky&quot; objects in the stall to desensitize him. Sadly, the objects did not help get over his spookiness.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I knew a horse who always backed into his stall for meals. </p>
<p>His paddock was connected to his stall and he could come and go as he pleased. You could put a halter on him and lead him in his stall, but if he was loose and it was feeding time, he ALWAYS came into the stall in reverse. I worked at the barn for several years and had the chance to observe it hundreds of times. </p>
<p>My only guess is that it has something to do with some despooking training he received as a youngster. He was an abnormally spooky horse, so his owners put lots of bright and &#8220;looky&#8221; objects in the stall to desensitize him. Sadly, the objects did not help get over his spookiness.</p>
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		<title>By: H. Houlahan</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-466288</link>
		<dc:creator>H. Houlahan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 15:54:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-466288</guid>
		<description>Jake and Mila aren&#039;t displaying superstitious behavior.

They are simply training their owners.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jake and Mila aren&#8217;t displaying superstitious behavior.</p>
<p>They are simply training their owners.</p>
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		<title>By: Jenny</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-466253</link>
		<dc:creator>Jenny</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 14:41:11 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-466253</guid>
		<description>Our Foxhound, Jake, has figured out that he can get our attention by &quot;tap-dancing&quot; on the hardwood floors.  When he wants to go outside, or it&#039;s close to dinner time, or he lost a toy under the couch, he prances around tick-tick-ticking his toenails (and sometimes adds a growly song along with his dance!).  Then it&#039;s just a matter of interpreting what he wants, but if you take too long the dance escalates into stomping/jumping/barking/temper tantrum.  It&#039;s kind of amusing though!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Our Foxhound, Jake, has figured out that he can get our attention by &#8220;tap-dancing&#8221; on the hardwood floors.  When he wants to go outside, or it&#8217;s close to dinner time, or he lost a toy under the couch, he prances around tick-tick-ticking his toenails (and sometimes adds a growly song along with his dance!).  Then it&#8217;s just a matter of interpreting what he wants, but if you take too long the dance escalates into stomping/jumping/barking/temper tantrum.  It&#8217;s kind of amusing though!</p>
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		<title>By: H. Houlahan</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-466237</link>
		<dc:creator>H. Houlahan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 14:11:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-466237</guid>
		<description>I&#039;ve trained a lot of dogs who develop a false association of danger to things they think signal an invisible fence barrier, because it does at their house.

Including:

utility marker flags (obviously)
&lt;i&gt;anything&lt;/i&gt; flapping in the wind
borders between driveway/street/sidewalk and lawn
hedges (approached from any angle)
rail fences
garden ponds
peonies
PVC pipe

And probably a bunch of stuff I&#039;m forgetting.

Nothing like working a dog on a nice, brisk training progression -- usually loose-lead walking or longe-lining -- and everything is going great guns, and suddenly, as I march forward, the dog is OUTTA HERE and my shoulder is rotated backwards in a manner not intended by its designer.

Me: &quot;Uh, do you use an invisible fence with this dog?&quot;

Owner: &quot;Why yes, why do you ask?&quot;

Then I have to figure out what the trigger is, and get the dog over it in several locations.

This can be very bad in dogs who are never walked because &quot;We have an invisible fence, he can run in the yard all he wants.&quot;  So the dog&#039;s brain has atrophied and his superstitions have multiplied.  Don&#039;t get me started ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;ve trained a lot of dogs who develop a false association of danger to things they think signal an invisible fence barrier, because it does at their house.</p>
<p>Including:</p>
<p>utility marker flags (obviously)<br />
<i>anything</i> flapping in the wind<br />
borders between driveway/street/sidewalk and lawn<br />
hedges (approached from any angle)<br />
rail fences<br />
garden ponds<br />
peonies<br />
PVC pipe</p>
<p>And probably a bunch of stuff I&#8217;m forgetting.</p>
<p>Nothing like working a dog on a nice, brisk training progression &#8212; usually loose-lead walking or longe-lining &#8212; and everything is going great guns, and suddenly, as I march forward, the dog is OUTTA HERE and my shoulder is rotated backwards in a manner not intended by its designer.</p>
<p>Me: &#8220;Uh, do you use an invisible fence with this dog?&#8221;</p>
<p>Owner: &#8220;Why yes, why do you ask?&#8221;</p>
<p>Then I have to figure out what the trigger is, and get the dog over it in several locations.</p>
<p>This can be very bad in dogs who are never walked because &#8220;We have an invisible fence, he can run in the yard all he wants.&#8221;  So the dog&#8217;s brain has atrophied and his superstitions have multiplied.  Don&#8217;t get me started &#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: Shauna</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-466234</link>
		<dc:creator>Shauna</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 14:07:48 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-466234</guid>
		<description>One night while we were sleeping our cat Mila thought it would be fun to open the on-suite bathroom cabinets , jump in the cabinet, exclaim “Mew Mew Mew!” excitedly, jump out, slam the cabinet and repeat. No idea why she started this game, but I gather that she thought it was super fun.  My husband didn’t want to kick her out of the bedroom (she’s usually a very good cat) but couldnt’ stop her from playing this very loud game. So he gave her some cat treats. Now when she wants cat treats she opens the closest cabinet, drawer or closet (she’s very smart and has figured out door knobs), jumps in, exclaims “Mew Mew Mew!” jumps out and slams the drawer/cabinet/closet, then waits. If no treats appear she repeats. Its very annoying to hear ‘Mew Mew Mew!”  *SLAM!*’ in the middle of the night.  Its been over a month and my husband continues to say  ‘aww! Isn’t she cute! I must give her a treat!’.  I keep telling him that he’s just reinforcing bad behaviour, but he continues. If she starts putting on weight I’m going to have to hide the treats – luckily she’s still active enough to burn off the extra calories, and she does only do this once or twice a day (therefore she gets 2 treats a day max).  If she only did this during the day I wouldn’t mind so much, but at 2am I’m not amused.
As an aside in case anyone is concerned: when Mila figured out how to open cabinets and drawers we immediately moved all hazardous materials out of the lower cabinets/drawers etc.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>One night while we were sleeping our cat Mila thought it would be fun to open the on-suite bathroom cabinets , jump in the cabinet, exclaim “Mew Mew Mew!” excitedly, jump out, slam the cabinet and repeat. No idea why she started this game, but I gather that she thought it was super fun.  My husband didn’t want to kick her out of the bedroom (she’s usually a very good cat) but couldnt’ stop her from playing this very loud game. So he gave her some cat treats. Now when she wants cat treats she opens the closest cabinet, drawer or closet (she’s very smart and has figured out door knobs), jumps in, exclaims “Mew Mew Mew!” jumps out and slams the drawer/cabinet/closet, then waits. If no treats appear she repeats. Its very annoying to hear ‘Mew Mew Mew!”  *SLAM!*’ in the middle of the night.  Its been over a month and my husband continues to say  ‘aww! Isn’t she cute! I must give her a treat!’.  I keep telling him that he’s just reinforcing bad behaviour, but he continues. If she starts putting on weight I’m going to have to hide the treats – luckily she’s still active enough to burn off the extra calories, and she does only do this once or twice a day (therefore she gets 2 treats a day max).  If she only did this during the day I wouldn’t mind so much, but at 2am I’m not amused.<br />
As an aside in case anyone is concerned: when Mila figured out how to open cabinets and drawers we immediately moved all hazardous materials out of the lower cabinets/drawers etc.</p>
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		<title>By: H. Houlahan</title>
		<link>http://www.petconnection.com/blog/2009/07/06/superstitious-behavior-animals-have-it-too/comment-page-1/#comment-466231</link>
		<dc:creator>H. Houlahan</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 06 Jul 2009 14:02:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.petconnection.com/blog/?p=7799#comment-466231</guid>
		<description>This is a good one for pet owners to think about -- especially how they&#039;ve inadvertently allowed or caused a superstitious behavior, whether one that is innocuous or one that is troublesome.

All four of my dogs now avoid the pond area where I have my ducks.

I figured out that this is because they first encountered the poultry electro-net there.  Each one of them got their first jolt from this stuff when I moved the ducks down there, and briefly had them protected by the netting.  And they likely got really nasty shocks, too, standing on damp or wet ground and touching the netting with their noses.  (I saw my male ES do just this, and felt really bad.)

The netting isn&#039;t meant to exclude or control the dogs in any way, but I use it all over the farm to keep goats in their current paddock and to keep predators off the range broiler chickens at night, and they obviously had to learn that it has a nasty bite.

Now the three ES will not come down and help me with the ducks in the evening.  No way, no how.

My German shepherd will come down and body dredge the pond, starting about a week ago, &lt;i&gt;if I am down there.&lt;/i&gt;  She&#039;s decided that the bitey-stingy doesn&#039;t work if I&#039;m there.  She is not a useful stock dog, though if the ducks are being jerks and won&#039;t come out of the pond and go to bed, she crashes that party and evicts them.

I took up the netting from that location two months ago, and there&#039;s nothing down there to even suggest it.  It&#039;s bright black and white netting, easy for any creature to see.

The same fencing is in use elsewhere on the property.  The dogs avoid the actual fence, but are not afraid of those locations, and will come within a foot or so of the fences, come inside the paddocks if asked, work the animals inside if asked.  I&#039;ve even seen them take some shocks when they absently brush against the fence, and they just jump and move away, same as the goats.

I have started working on the location aversion by bringing the ES down as close as they will come and having them hold stays at a spot just over their comfort threshold while I take care of the ducks.  In the past week they&#039;ve come about 60&#039; closer, and I should have them underfoot in another few days.  But I bet it will be a lot longer before they are relaxed enough to actually help with the #&amp;%#! ducks at night.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is a good one for pet owners to think about &#8212; especially how they&#8217;ve inadvertently allowed or caused a superstitious behavior, whether one that is innocuous or one that is troublesome.</p>
<p>All four of my dogs now avoid the pond area where I have my ducks.</p>
<p>I figured out that this is because they first encountered the poultry electro-net there.  Each one of them got their first jolt from this stuff when I moved the ducks down there, and briefly had them protected by the netting.  And they likely got really nasty shocks, too, standing on damp or wet ground and touching the netting with their noses.  (I saw my male ES do just this, and felt really bad.)</p>
<p>The netting isn&#8217;t meant to exclude or control the dogs in any way, but I use it all over the farm to keep goats in their current paddock and to keep predators off the range broiler chickens at night, and they obviously had to learn that it has a nasty bite.</p>
<p>Now the three ES will not come down and help me with the ducks in the evening.  No way, no how.</p>
<p>My German shepherd will come down and body dredge the pond, starting about a week ago, <i>if I am down there.</i>  She&#8217;s decided that the bitey-stingy doesn&#8217;t work if I&#8217;m there.  She is not a useful stock dog, though if the ducks are being jerks and won&#8217;t come out of the pond and go to bed, she crashes that party and evicts them.</p>
<p>I took up the netting from that location two months ago, and there&#8217;s nothing down there to even suggest it.  It&#8217;s bright black and white netting, easy for any creature to see.</p>
<p>The same fencing is in use elsewhere on the property.  The dogs avoid the actual fence, but are not afraid of those locations, and will come within a foot or so of the fences, come inside the paddocks if asked, work the animals inside if asked.  I&#8217;ve even seen them take some shocks when they absently brush against the fence, and they just jump and move away, same as the goats.</p>
<p>I have started working on the location aversion by bringing the ES down as close as they will come and having them hold stays at a spot just over their comfort threshold while I take care of the ducks.  In the past week they&#8217;ve come about 60&#8217; closer, and I should have them underfoot in another few days.  But I bet it will be a lot longer before they are relaxed enough to actually help with the #&amp;%#! ducks at night.</p>
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