Pet food recall: Liveblogging the Congressional hearing
By Christie Keith
April 24, 2007
- If you have a sick pet or a question on your pet’s health, call your veterinarian.
- If you want your say on food-safety reform, Sen. Durbin’s office wants to hear from you.
- If you’re new to the site, please check out our general information page (includes links to recalled foods).
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- If you want to report a sick or deceased pet, click here.
The U.S. House of Representatives’ Committee on Energy and Commerce’s Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations is holding a hearing on “Diminished Capacity: Can the FDA Assure the Safety and Security of the Nation’s Food Supply?” You can watch a video webcast here (Windows Media Player required.)
Witnesses will include Paul K. Henderson, CEO, Menu Foods and Stephen S. Miller, CEO, ChemNutra, Inc.The full witness list is here (PDF).
I’m listening in and will report as it goes along, and will liveblog anything specific to the pet food recall. Right now, they’re just doing an introduction, and are discussing the contaminated pet food as well as other food safety issues, including the contamination of spinach and peanut butter with e. coli.
The entire live-blogging session is on the next page.
Mr. Waxman (D-CA): Many have tried to change things on food safety issues, and couldn’t even get a hearing. Sometimes minor changes are made after an incident, but then the mood for change disappears. “FDA system for overseeing the safety of our food is all but broken.” “We inspect only a tiny fraction of the food we import.” Warns our food supply is susceptible to attack.
“We need to do more than tweak the system… we need to examine the system as a whole.”
Three problems with FDA: Inadequte resources, standards, and enforcement.
A 24 percent budget cut in food safety - I think he said over $300 milllion dollar cut?
FDA inspected the ConAgra peanut butter plant DURING the e coli contamination.
FDA must set clear standards for soil contamination, unclean water, and worker sanitation, including or imported produce.
“This voluntary approach does not work.”
“FDA has the authority to do this now. I hope they will act.”
“FDA can and must do better.”
Recalls are chipping away at the confidence of consumers - which hurts industry.
Mr. Green (Texas, not sure of party):
The GAO dubbed the country’s food supply as “high risk.” He doesn’t think the average American believes that, but something needs to be done.
Says there will be future hearings regarding the FDA, which has too little authority, too few resources, and too much to do. FDA action is often too late. This is inexcusable. Wants to see an expansion of FDA authority.
Common denominator of peanut butter, spinach, and pet food problems is lack of appropriate testing.
Mr. Barton of Texas:
We began inspecting FDA last October. Some records of that investigation will be helpful in this one.
This is just a preliminary hearing. We only have partial information at this time and are not in as good a position as he would like to be.
Given such limitations, and to be fair, let’s not rush conclusions based on this hearing by itself.
However, he does say the reluctance of the Chinese government to allow investigation related to the pet food recall concerns him. FDA has traced the problem to melamine found in wheat gluten, rice protein concentrate. FDA is also investigating contamation in hogs “possibly bound for the human market.” (Note: No “possibly” about it.)
China only yesterday agreed to let FDA in. He says this is totally unacceptable. American consumers have the right to know they are safe.
Says there is a long history of contamination in China. Cited 1998 investigation - 155 US citizens sickened by a Chinese antibiotic. Counterfeit animal drugs. Numerous discrepancies.
Rep. Jan Schakowsky (D-IL):
Not just food safety, but national security.
Need to follow recommendation of GAO and consolidate food safety programs.
Had called on hearing on this issue before, glad it’s finally happening.
“We also have to start holding food, including pet food, conglomerates accountable now.”
Employees are instructed to hide product codes and not give information to investigators. This keeps us in the dark about what they’re doing to the food “that makes it to our kitchen table.” Says “corporate shenanigans” will be revealed at this hearing.
Talks about 1969-70 when a “group of young mothers” got manufacturers and retailers to freshness-date foods, which is not ubiquitous.
Says food product inspection is not a priority for FDA, even though import of ingredients has increased by 73 percent. “Frighteningly easy way” for terrorists to attack US food supply.
Mr. Burgess, TX:
“America has the safest, least expensive, most abundant food supply in the world.” He never used to wonder if it would be safe to eat. The security of the food supply was never in question in his mind. Recent outbreaks have caught the country’s attention.
Says melamine contamation “is not only wrong, it’s criminal.” Says Hurricane Katrina showed us Americans consider their pets as members of the family, and putting them at risk is unacceptable. Is very glad the committee included pet food recall in the hearing. Says this hearing is only the beginning. Welcomes companies here to tell “their side of the story.”
Says nothing is 100 percent safe, but looks forward to hearing what role the companies have in this situation. Innocent people and animals should not have to die due to a mistake OR to criminal behavior. This must not happen again.
Mr. Dingle, MI:
“Inadequacies” of the FDA. Every American has reason to worry.
Not just foods and cosmetics, but also drugs. Reminds that the wheat gluten ordered was of “the highest grade,” and these types of human ingredients, proteins, can end up in human food.
Were contaminated deliberately.
Came from our trading partners in China.
Was for greed, not terrorism, but it could have been the other way around.
Melamine fraudulently elevates protein levels in gluten and increases the money they can get. Profiteers have drawn a roadmap through holes in our regulatory system.
Up to yesterday, China would not let inspectors into the contaminated wheat gluten factories. The response of this administration was to only stop imports from ONE COMPANY. “Chinese wheat gluten continues to pour into this country.” Gambling with American health so as not to disturb trading profits of the Chinese. The government response has been a “national scandal.”
Will be more hearings, calling FDA to account for their imperfect stewardship of the public health, in two weeks. See what resources they need to carry out their important mission.
FDA tracing too many imports with too few resources for too many years. Good people in the field report how disillusioned they have become with management of FDA. Some resign. Some are driven out. Closure of FDA port facilities threaten food and health products supply.
FDA has some serious accounting to do. Playing with lives of Americans.
Ms. Blackburn, TN:
Food safety. National security. Invokes 9/11 and national sense of vulnerability, particularly of food and water supplies. Also food and agricultural infrastructure is at risk.
Americans are consuming increasing amounts of imported food and drink. FDA only has enough inspectors to check about 1 percent of imported food shipments. “So, we do have to realize this means we have an increased vulnerability.”
Is this size? Lack of resources? Faulty priorities?
Is the FDA capable of restructuring to address these concerns, or are they turning a deaf ear and blind eye?
What is the expected level of corporate, beauracratic, and personal responsibility?
We must seek greater accountability. We must expect that all imports are going to meet our US safety standards. They are rigorous, and we intend for them to be met. Our food supply is generally considered safe, but there are vulnerabilities.
Jay Inslee, WA:
Meat industry not involved because of earlier efforts related to previous outbreaks. Need to apply those standards to other parts of the industry.
Notes four things:
Need BINDING standards. “Voluntary guidance is clearly a recipe for failure, injury, and even death.” Says FDA use of the word “should” means we’re not requiring food safety.
Hazard point identification programs must be established, as has been done in meat industry.
We need to treat e. coli and salmonella as ADULTERANTS. It is only common sense, he says.
Fourth, MUST HAVE MANDATORY RECALL AUTHORITY. That we don’t have a mechanism in that regard beggars belief.
Industry itself has a stake in the ability to stop loss of confidence in its products.
Mr. Murphy, PA:
Missed this, sorry.
First panel introduced. The Armstrong family of Indiana. Telling story of daughter Isabella, who was made sick from contaminated spinach. She will need a kidney transplant.
Ms. Terri Marshall of LA:
Her mother-in-law ate contaminated peanut butter (salmonella). Life before Peter Pan peanut butter:
85 year old mother in law moved in in 2006. Could make her bed, make her own meals, read papers and magazines, went to beauty shop, dress herself. Liked to walk in yard, go out to meals, eat at table with dinner, and even help around the house. Kept in touch with friends and family. Kept a jar of Peter Pan peanut better on her nightstand, as a supplemental way to increase her nutrition. Would eat a spoonful or two every day. The very food she thought would improve her health ended up ravaging her body.
January of 2007, became ill and put in hospital. Last time she was at home.
Heard news of Peter Pan recall in mid-Februrary. Went to nursing home to check her peanut butter. Yes, the numbers did match the recall. Had been eating contaminated peanut butter in the hospital and nursing home.
Next week a rep of Dept of Health sent lab report… positive for salmonella. She was on a vicious cycle of salmonella poisoning.
She has lost her life but hasn’t died. She has been in hospital or nursing home. Cannot walk, get out of bed, read papers or magazines, talk on the telephone, or drive in a car. She gets nutrition in a feeding tube. Can’t even drink water. She is back in nursing home from hospital. Cannot even eat.
“We will forever be changed” in how they purchase and prepare food. She will never eat peanut butter again.
Mr. Gary Pruden and Sean Pruden from PA:
My son Sean is 11 and he contracted e. coli from eating at a Taco Bell in PA before Thanksgiving. As a parent, you don’t know what’s going on. We often want our kids to eat their vegetables. The other kids wouldn’t eat them that time. Sean did, and he was infected.
The family doctor, who they visited twice, didn’t recognize the problem, didn’t get the diagnosis. Took to ER after they heard news reports of outbreak at Taco Bell. Rushed to medical center in Hershey by ambulance.
There is no treatment, you wait it out. Dialysis, blood transfusions. Fortunately Sean did not have to have dialysis, but was in a very bad state for 4-5 days. Did not know what outcome would be. Fortunately did recover, but they aren’t certain of longterm effects.
Exhausting to family. Time away from business. Sense of guilt.
Public oversight. “A key element of successful commerce and trade is trust.” Food should be edible and safe. Without this trust, commerce can’t work. Oversight is required.
Fortunate Sean has recovered. This testimony must compel better oversight.
Opening to questions.
Packaging labeled “ready to eat,” does it give impression it’s been tested?
Parents responded that packaging said “triple-washed.” Now they know it means nothing.
What should we as policy makers be doing?
Needed is consistent oversight. Outbreaks occur, lots of press, people up in arms, then it drops. Six months later it will happen again. Need more consistent oversight, more coordination between departments, and at state and county level too.
Ms. Marshall said the January 3 lab report said “salmonella.” They never heard the word salmonella at all until Feb 23 when health department called and asked if she was better. Asked if anyone else in family was sick. That’s when they told her it was salmonella - 9-10 days after recall, first time they heard that word. If they’d heard salmonella the first week in January they could identified the peanut butter immediately, because no one in the family ate it. They could have stopped her from eating the peanut butter while she was in the hospital. But they didn’t get the information. Nothing was triggered to say this is a problem, and figure out what was contaminated. They could have taken appropriate action. They would have pulled it a lot sooner, rather than waiting for ConAgra to say “pull it.”
Mr. Armstrong said it’s his job to protect his little girls. He found out he can’t protect them from spinach. “Only you guys can.” Says the wrong answer is to keep doing what we’re doing, because it’s not working.
Edward Whitfield (R-KY) asked:
Did FDA or CDA ever contact you?
No. Ms. Marshall heard only from local health dept, long later.
Mr. Armstrong contacted local health agencies… HE reached out to them.
No one has heard from national agencies.
Thanked panel.
Diana DeGette (D-CO):
Lack of cooperation from ConAgra and other issues slowed down proper treatment of Ms. Marhsall’s mother in law.
People are relying on their own deductive reasoning, news accounts to figure out what’s going on. Mr. Pruden says family doctor’s diagnosis was wrong, and at some point you have to connect the dots. It gets lost. Needs a better reporting system to help families put two and two together.
Michael Burgess (R-TX):
Asked why two daughters got sick a few days apart - answer was, time of onset of illness is variable.
Rep. Burgess is an MD (obstetrician). Commented on the fact that feeding the contaminated peanut butter in the hospital is a nightmare.
NOTE: Took a short break to obtain caffeine.
Jan Schakowsky (D-IL) is talking about all the things companies don’t have to give to FDA inspectors. Asked if any of the family members had comments.
One of the fathers said the pieces aren’t being put together, even though there was an outbreak in a neighboring county, the Taco Bells weren’t shut down, even when he explained it to the local health department. Didn’t even have to report it, btw.
Inslee:
Will be working on a bill to prevent contamination in the first place. Wants to focus on prevention, not just notification etc.
Make sure there are enforceable standards, not just wish lists. Industry must adopt what meat industry did, to identify hazards and eliminate them. Criminal penalties. Mandatory recall authority.
Industry doesn’t like to be told what to do, but thinks these are reasonable proposals.
One of the fathers agrees, prevention has to be number one priority, but “after the fact” is also important - because if the truth is available, he doesn’t know how industries can be profitable, because no one will buy their products. I think what he’s saying is that a system of notification that people can really rely on will increase consumer trust ONLY if the news that system reveals is GOOD news. So notification will also support prevention.
Rep from MI commented that the Armstrongs and the Prudens were both made sick by produce from CA, even though they live in other states. Thanked and dismissed the families.
Next panel is put under oath. Neither wanted counsel present.
Ms. Lisa Shames, Acting Director, National Resources and Environment, US Government Accountability Office (GAO) is introduced.
Says while food supply is mostly safe, these outbreaks underscore risks. Each year CDC reports that around 76 million contract food borne illness.
Two points:
GAO designated food safety on high risk list because of lack of oversight, inefficient use of oversight, and lack of coordinator.
15 agencies, over 30 laws.
Resources spent do not align with risks of food contamination. Compares USDA and FDA funding… USDA gets more money to inspect far less than FDA.
Limitations in recall programs heighten the risk. Food recalls are VOLUNTARY. Neither FDA nor USDA can issue a mandatory order, except for infant formula. Other agencies… products, and trffic safety… can order recalls, establish recall requirements, impose monetary penalties.
In Oct 2004, USDA and FDA did not know details about ongoing recalls. Ineffective.
Proposed Congress enact legislation requiring companies to alert the public, and give both agencies mandatory recall authority.
Federal oversight of food safety needs to be addressed. Weaknesses caused by current fragmented system. Need to restore public confidence.
Dr. Anthony DeCarlo, Red Bank Veterinary Hospital.
Speaks to need for notification system for veterinarians. Vet community does not have the resources to do this in a timely manner. Many vet practices have only enough staff to meet the needs of their existing patients. Many vets heard about the story only on TV. Having a central reporting agency could be the key factor in heading off similar problems in the future.
NOTE: I don’t understand who this vet is. His practice website doesn’t mention any particular credentials that might make him a good witness here. Anyone know?
He is being pressed on the numbers, hard. He’s wriggling.
“We’re a small profession… Who reports where is a very subjective thing.”
“There really needs to be an organized and focused place” for vets to report. That’s why we don’t have any facts.
Pressing for numbers continues.
He is still resisting. He says at his hospital, death rate has been only around 1 percent. (His practice is a specialty hospital.)
Missed a bit of discussion with Ms. Shames while looking up who Dr. DeCarlo is. Found this. He was identified as a neurologist in one article, but I don’t see anything indicating that on his practice website.
Back to Ms. Shames.
Mr. Whitfield asks Ms. Shames why there are no mandatory recalls for food as there are for tires and toys. What would have happened if ConAgra had not recalled peanut butter voluntarily?
She says the government couldn’t have forced it.
He now asks Dr. DeCarlo about FDA and USDA requirements about testing for chemicals and drugs in animals raised for human consumption.
Dr. DeCarlo says that it’s concerning (melamine in hogs, for instance) and confusing for vets. It’s only been recently we’ve found out where there can be testing for melamine. We need a system. The less agencies involved, simplicity works most efficiently.
Ms. Shames says that mandatory recall authority will make businesses more forthcoming, to stay ahead of the curve. Other agencies (”tires and toys”) report this.
Right now, health care providers report to county, then to CDC, then “some eager reporter” gets ahold of it, is there a more efficient way to publicize recalls and outbreaks of diseases?
Ms. Shames says Oct 2004 report found that consumer groups say information could be more effective… more specificity. FDA is following through on that tone recommendation. FDA includes a photo of the product, for instance.
No geographic notification. FDA officials said they don’t even have the authority to identify a place or retail where a contaminated product has come from. (???????????)
Rep. Walden (Oregon) addresses Ms. Shames about import regulations, and if countries can use chemicals we don’t permit in the US on food they sell us.
She says FDA has authority to have “equivalency agreements.” This seemed very non-responsive to me.
He asks, was there not an outbreak on melons? Turns out there was human waste used as fertilizer, then melons were imported here?
She says she’s not familiar, but that was a hypothesis for the e coli spinach contamination. Although currently it’s thought to be a runoff problem from wild animals.
Walden asks about “washed” labeling. Does washing remove e. coli?
She says rinsing “helps,” but doesn’t really know.
Walden asks about inspections, and chemicals used in foreign companies. Then he switches to asking about Banfield’s data system - asking Dr. DeCarlo if a partnership with Banfield will help in identifying.
DeCarlo says yes, but the databases need to come from several areas. There are general practices, such as Banfield, plus specialty practices, vet school hospitals, and shelters. Diagnoses based on different criteria. Some will overdiagnose, some will underdiagnose. You also have to look at volume and location.
DeCarlo says if we choose hospitals, they need to have sophisticated IT, not just equipment but staffing.
Walden asks about animal diseases that can affect humans.
DeCarlo says “this model is not new.” New Jersey is looking at this issue. There is no question, he says, the vets need a single place to send this information.
Inslee asked if it was “just accident” that the wheat gluten didn’t end up in the human food supply.
Asked why we can have a recall for cars, but not on stuff we put into our body.
Ms. Shames says they are looking at the food safety issues in other countries. Canada has mandatory food recall. Need to study. See what makes sense in this country.
Mr. Burgess:
Asked Dr. DeCarlo about aminopterin, now melamine. Why did aminopterin get named at first?
Dr. DeCarlo says “I am probably not the right person to ask that question. You probably had information from the same sources I do.”
Burgess answered, “CNN.” Asked if he’s sure that melamine is causing this.
DeCarlo says YES, from “what I can read on the medical side.” (NOTE: This isn’t correct. He says “the majority of the literature” is confident it’s melamine causing the symptoms. Again, that’s not correct. There is much talk “on the medical side” that melamine is likely a marker but not the actual cause.)
Burgess asked about indoor vs outdoor animals. DeCarlo says he cannot answer that.
Burgess asks Ms. Shames US food supply vs other countries, and if she said the US food supply is safe. Does any country have a more streamlined model that suggests a better way to do this?
She says they are looking at other countries, started out as fragmented, piecemeal. Went for more consolidated approach. Some merged all agencies into one agency. Others reduced number. We are now, at the request of Durbin and DeLauro, looking at the positive consequences of these countries’ reorganizations of their food safety systems.
Burgess asked if a company or manufacturer has refused to issue a recall? She says not that she knows of.
Has there been foot dragging?
She says that agencies with mandatory recall authority feel it is a tool they have although they don’t use it often.
He pressed, has anyone said if we’d had the authority to MANDATE a recall, something wouldn’t have happened?
She said no.
Rep. Blackburn:
Do you think federal government should have the authority to mandate recalls?
Ms. Shames says USDA and FDA should, yes.
Rep. Blackburn says even medical profession does not access CDC information.
(SHORT BREAK HERE FOR ME SO I CAN FOCUS ON THE MENU AND CHEMNUTRA WITNESSES LATER.)
Third panel put under oath.
# Mr. Paul K. Henderson
CEO, Menu Foods
# Mr. Stephen S. Miller
CEO, ChemNutra, Inc.
# Mr. David Colo
Sr. Vice-president, Manufacturing
ConAgra Foods, Inc.
# Mr. Charles Sweat
President
Natural Selection Foods
Henderson of Menu Foods is represented by counsel, as is Stephen Miller of ChemNutra. Neither of the human side witnesses has an atttorney present.
Paul Henderson of Menu Foods opening statement:
Says he is a pet owner and his dog eats Menu foods. Understands loss felt by pet owners. Deeply sympathizes.
Outlines all inspections his plants go through. Says never had a food safety product recall in the last 75 years.
Says much speculation has been inaccurate. Says he provided a timeline in writing, will not repeat.
This is NOT a situation caused by unclean facilities or poor manufacturing.
Lax inspections did not contribute to this problem.
They did not react inappropriately. They reacted properly based on information they had at the time.
They said at the time they issued the recall, they had no idea what was causing the kidney failure, said they had only a small handful of reports from consumers (said three from one consumer?) and customers, and from one taste test facility when it issued recall, even though they had no evidence it was their food causing the problem. He said it took researchers “weeks” to figure out ChemNutra wheat gluten was the source of the problem.
Said this was FRAUD, deliberate contamination. They have discontinued all business relationships with ChemNutra. Worked with FDA. Cooperated fully.
Mr. Charles Sweat, president of Natural Selection Foods. Discusses spinach e. coli outbreak.
Interesting to hear his testing protocol following the recall. Testing, testing, testing. Says much more needs to be done, including development of standards. “We welcome regulation in this arena, but with or without regulation” industry should WELCOME more regulation, and can in fact implement many changes more rapidly than government, and should and must do so.
Dave Colo of ConAgra begins.
Says they are fully aligned to ensure our food supply is “among the safest in the world.”
Outlines the outbreak of salmonella in peanut butter. Begins by saying he is SORRY.
Goes over timeline. Says they didn’t hear until February there had been a statistical study done by CDC that suggested ConAgra’s pb products MAY have been linked to illnesses. The next day, the company voluntarily recalled ALL pb products, and closed one facility.
Initiated investigation. ConAgra worked with FDA. Believes moisture “inadvertently” entered manufacturing process and allowed salmonella to grow. Rate of contamination was low and not detected by their testing program.
The facility has been idle since recall issued. Is implementing signifigant changes to facility. Estimated cost is $15-20 million. ConAgra is committed to taking the time for each of these steps and doesn’t expect to re-open until August.
Is now inspecting all other manufacturing facilities. Dr. Mike Doyle, food safety specialist, and others are inspecting. Committed to food safety. Working closely with FDA. Appreciates FDA and CDC.
Has provided committee with summary of their procedures assuring rapid FDA access.
Once more said how sorry they are… “truly sorry”… for the people who might have been harmed. His voice is trembling a little.
Now Miller from ChemNutra:
Safety of the food supply is important.
ChemNutra is a small business in Las Vegas. He introduces lawyer.
Expresses “support and condolences” to pet owners whose pets have died, and those who have become fearful. Also offers his sympathy to pet food companies.
Says until March 8, ChemNutra had never had any problems with their Chinese sources. Only on March 8 did they learn Menu was investigating wheat gluten, almost 3 weeks after Menu learned of possible contamination in pet food.
The next day, ChemNutra froze all wheat gluten in their supplies.
Says that Menu announced recall some time later, DID NOT MENTION WHEAT GLUTEN.
Only on March 29 did ChemNutra hear about melamine.
On April 2, issued a recall.
Says there are many suppositions and few facts. They know there is melamine in the shipment of wheat gluten. Says they think the company in China added melamine to up the protein content.
Melamine was not something tested for in the past, although they are now.
Says there was a similar incident 30 years ago with urea contamination for the same reason. Says since then, we test for urea.
Chair asked:
What do the other three of the four customers make?
All make pet food, like Menu.
Chair asked:
What did you so with remaining wheat gluten?
It’s quarantined in our warehouse.
Will be disposed of?
Working with FDA.
Asks Mr. Colo:
In October ‘04, you found salmonella in your peanut butter, right? Colo agrees.
Chair says, FDA never obtained information they asked for about the 2004 salmonella.
Colo says that product was NEVER SHIPPED. FDA asked for records in 2005. ConAgra asked FDA to request in writing, FDA never did and never followed up.
Chair asks: Has FDA or USDA asked about possible contamination and ask for records, and ConAgra did not provide it?
He says that their procedure would be to ask for such requests to be made in writing.
Chair says, we hear rumors that you stonewall.
Colo says he’s not aware of all requests from FDA, can’t answer at this time. Is asked to follow up.
Chair asks Henderson:
You said melamine was added intentionally. Fraud.
Chair asks, What gluten is used in things other than pet food? Henderson agrees.
Chair asks, you can’t know until after the fact, right?
Henderson says that’s right, melamine is not a contaminant for which there was a testing protocol. Doesn’t know if it’s happened before, or is happening now.
Chair asks, you order from Miller. Henderson says yes.
Chair asks, Mr. Miller, you order from China then?
Miller says yes.
Questions about the Chinese supplier. Had ChemNutra used them before? Yes. Were there problems before? Says no. Says wheat gluten was a new product for them (ChemNutra).
Chair asking Mr. Sweat about product packaging on Natural Selection spinach. Asked what “completely washed” on label means.
Discussion of process.
Asked about testing for e. coli.
Sweat said they’d never had food borne illness on product, so basically no. But Chair asks about e coli contamination in other products grown in the area. He immediately steered his response to how they RESPONDED, and talked about using beef industry protocols now (post-outbreak).
Chair asks questions about processing. Asks about investigations. FDA investigated the facility very week of the contamination. FDA does not require testing. FDA just looked around at process. No testing.
Chair asks Henderson, you’re in US and Canada. Are you inspected by the FDA? New Jersey was inspected in 2006. Doesn’t have dates of other inspections. Says about once a year. Says USDA inspects annually. Says Canadian plant is inspected annually.
Chair asks about an outbreak in France? What outbreak was in France?
Mr. Whitfield is asking Henderson questions about its financial standing (publicly traded in Canada), and how much wheat gluten they use in a year, and what percentage used in a year is from US… says he doesn’t know.
Whitfield then asks Miller if it’s not around 25 percent, nationwide. He agrees.
Asking about Miller’s wife who is president of ChemNutra and is from China. Asks if, since his wife is a citizen of China, they might have additional recourse. Miller says he has not looked into that, but will.
Whitfield asks Mr. Henderson about finished product testing program at Menu, and says he assumes it would not detect melamine.
Program at Menu, he says, is the testing of the raw materials, rather than testing finished product. Cooking is supposed to deal with bacterial contamination. They test the raw materials, not the finished product. They test for toxins in the raw material… such as testing wheat gluten for vomitoxin… but not for melamine.
Whitfield asks if FDA requires any of the testing they do. Henderson says no.
Whitfield asks Mr. Colo if FDA requires finished product testing of their products. Says no.
Colo says they sample one jar of peanut butter per packing line per day. Hold all peanut butter until tests are back.
Whitfield asks if there is a method that could definitively remove e coli and salmonella. Sweat says he doesn’t believe there’s a final kill step that could be implemented.
Whitfield asks about irradiation. FDA does not approve for use on fruits and vegetables, nor peanut butter.
Some timeline questions about the peanut butter contamination.
Ms. DeGette:
Asks Sweat if they found out what caused spinach contamination. He says no, and the investigation has been closed.
Asked Colo from ConAgra about 2005 investigation. They review this at length.
Colo repeats that their policy is to make FDA ask for information in writing. She is framing this that even though FDA notified them of some issues, they didn’t do anything because it wasn’t in writing, and he appears to be agreeing that’s the case.
She continues to go over their testing, timeline, and other issues related to peanut butter contamination.
Now Mr. Walden of Oregon is grilling ConAgra about the peanut butter contamination. He asks if mandatory recall would make a difference to any of them.
Henderson says no, he doesn’t think it would have made any difference. They wouldn’t have done anything differently.
Sweat says they went to a voluntary recall in less than 24 hours, so no.
Colo says FDA having recall authority wouldn’t change anything they are doing today. (Doesn’t quite answer about if it would have changed what they were doing at the time.)
Miller says it wouldn’t matter to them, either.
Walden then asks them what could be done to improve safety. Says his shopping habits have been affected, he’s making different choices. What do you recommend we do to improve food safety? Your companyies’ bottom lines are in the crosshairs here.
Henderson: The ability of inspections to be taken by US authorities in those jurisdictions where exports are being made. Says Toronto plant has to get approval and qualify to ship product to US, or to Europe. Says that companies should be certified and inspected and accredited in order to import to the US. Says that way, the plant in China would have been inspected.
Then Walden asks if mandatory country of origin labeling wouldn’t help.
Henderson says that no, they don’t have that level of information.
Walden says, wouldn’t you like to?
Henderson says there has to be some element of accountability through the chain. Says the people they deal with are “known suppliers.” He doesn’t believe tracing the supply chain is commercially practical.
Sweat answers regarding produce. Then Walden is out of time.
The chair now asks Henderson about the timeline. March 16 was first recall. March 24 was second recall. April 5 was third recall. April 10 was fourth. A recall authority by the FDA would have sped that up, no?
Henderson says no. At the time of the March 16 recall, they didn’t know the nature of the problem.
Chair says I’m not asking about the problem. I’m asking if FDA recall authority wouldn’t have made this take less than a month. Says Iams really got the ball rolling here, not you, by saying they were going to recall their foods. Says he thinks FDA authority might have limited the scope.
Henderson said the conversation with Iams involved the sharing of information, then a meeting the next day to exchange what they knew. “Iams opted to recall. We went along. We announced first.”
Chair says, this was three weeks after you had dead animals in testing.
Sweat is discussing again reaching out to the standards of the beef industry and reviewing testing and prevention program. Says their current finished products testing program has found NO contamination.
Inslee asks if this program should be the industry standard. Sweat says yes, but science needs to come up with more. Industry needs to invest more in science and research. Adds additional interventions and hurdles for health safety. Mentions “Leafy Green Marketing Agreement” in CA.
Inslee asks if they’ve considered ozone treatment as a kill step. Sweat says ozone is hard to control with water, but they are looking at many different sanitizers. Have set up a biohazard lab level 3 to test wash systems. Inslee mentions new ozone sterilization system that is in his district. Sweat is not familiar. Inslee says he’ll send him info.
Inslee asks what they do when they get a positive from the field. That lot is destroyed and that field is audited. They have so far not been able to find links to the field in tested product.
Inslee asks how about if FDA required this testing, would you be okay with that? Sweat says yes.
Inslee asks more about Moneterey County CA outbreaks of e coli.
Inslee asks Miller if gluten was food grade. Miller says yes, it was good grade.
Inslee says, we just dodged a bullet.
Miller says yes, and says China knew it was going into pet food. But Inslee pushes, and says it was sold as food grade and could have gone into human consumption. Miller says yes.
Miller says his surmise is that this was intentional fraud to make money, of which they are a victim as are their customers. Believes that the Chinese were aware their customers were pet food customers.
Inslee asks if there would have been other standards or protocols to prevent this from going into the human food supply. Miller agrees there were not. Calls this contamination “off the radar.”
Inslee says we should consider this as a human adulterant. Miller agreed.
Mr. Burgess asks Mr. Henderson if we don’t really know if the melamine was added by someone “with larceny in his heart.” Then he asked Mr. Sweat if they had a direct link to where the e coli came from. Then he asked the Chair about connecting dots and asking if these “spectacularly unrelated” events might not be connected after all.
Chinese gluten, Canadian catfood, Mexican spinach… why do we import gluten from China? Can’t we produce gluten here? Is it economic?
Henderson says from a wheat perspective is that 50 percent of the wheat gluten used in the US comes from Europe. There is not enough capacity to meet the demands.
Miller says some of what comes from Europe originates in other countries.
What steps are being taken to prosecute the foreign supplier? Are we trying to determine who did what, and whom to prosecute?
Henderson says the FDA is trying to get into China. Says there is not much they (Menu) can do.
Now asking Colo about peanuts and salmonella.
More discussion with Sweat about testing and the e coli outbreak.
I have now been liveblogging for FOUR HOURS. I’m going to have to stop soon.
One representative asked Henderson on behalf of his constituents and his dog, when will things get back to normal?
Henderson says recall is “still going on” as he sits here today. Focus on getting all product back off shelves. Then they’ll begin shipping product manufactured with tested gluten - next week or two.
Stupak asked for some info on inspections to be provided in the next week. Henderson asked how far back. Stupak said 2000 to April 2007. Henderson agreed, then the others did as well.
The hearing is concluded.
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Thank you Christie! I’m drinking coffee for you!
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 6:48 am
I was just looking at the witness list… are they actually speaking with people who lost their pets? Seems like it, according to Panel I.
Anyway, thanks for the reminder… listening now!
Comment by Elderta — April 24, 2007 @ 6:56 am
*passes Christie a rolling IV of caffeine*
Los Angeles is close to San Fran but not *that* close.
I find the rolling IV works well at this eye-squinting-early-as-heck time of day. You go girl!
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 6:57 am
Joe Barton (R) TX (ex officio)
Diane DeGette (D) CO
Henry Waxman (D) CA
Ed Whitfield (R) KY Ranking Member
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 7:02 am
Gene Green (D) TX
Waxman (D) CA
Diane DeGette (D) CO
Whitfield (R) KY Ranking member
Mike Doyle (D) PA
Tim Murphy (R) PA
Walden (R) OR
Schakowsky (D) IL
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 7:09 am
They are airing on a Live Video Broadcast if you have Windows Media:
http://energycommerce.house.go.....dule.shtml
Thanks Christie! I having a cup o’java too, in your honor!
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 7:10 am
oooops! I’m having…
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 7:10 am
‘FDA is also investigating contamation in hogs “possibly bound for the human market.” (Note: No “possibly” about it.)’
Right Christie. Unless these are family pets, what the heck else could they be ‘bound’ for? Seems like they are trying to downplay things, as usual.
Comment by slt — April 24, 2007 @ 7:11 am
Thanks to all drinking coffee for me. Whimper.
Comment by Christie Keith — April 24, 2007 @ 7:11 am
RE: Committee Hearing…I like the tone of what is being said in their opening remarks - These legislators are getting to the substantive aspects of this mess.
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 7:16 am
Michael Burgess (R) TX
Jay Inslee (D) WA
Mike Ferguson (R) NJ
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 7:20 am
I also want to hear questions brought up like. . .
Why would you paint a picture of your brand in your advertising, as prepared in Natures Organic Kitchen, when in fact it is manufactured my Menu Foods?
Comment by Steve — April 24, 2007 @ 7:22 am
Lots of pats on the back for taking on this difficult job of relating what these people are saying. I did log onto the hearing website and am able to listen in. No video as I am on dialup but you can listen with extremely good audio quality.
Comment by Lil Bear's Momma — April 24, 2007 @ 7:22 am
Feb 20th - Menu Foods receives first reports of problems with pet food.
Feb 26th - Menu foods commence tests on 50 animals.
Feb 26th & 27th - Menus CFO sells half his shares for $102,900.
March 16th - Recall announced. Share price plunges
April 10th - CFO calls this a “horrible coincidence”
Comment by Steve — April 24, 2007 @ 7:23 am
It sounds like the family whose little boy died from spinach will talk,+ a Family who lost a pet will talk. it’s a shame C-Span does not have this on TV. I Hope There Are Charges Brought Against Who Ever Did This To Our Pets.
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 7:26 am
Steve,
Didn’t Martha Stuart do prison time for exactly what Menu’s CFO did?
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 7:27 am
Marsha Blackburn (R) TN
Her main thing is securing the borders. OUght to be right up her alley, tho I don’t think that’s what she meant!
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 7:30 am
Comment by Steve — April 24, 2007 @ 7:22 am
…made with ingredients that you don’t know where they came from or if they are safe.
Comment by slt — April 24, 2007 @ 7:32 am
FDA SHOULD BE GIVEN MORE AUTHORITY
>TO ISSUE MANDATORY RECALLS
>TO FORCIBLY PULL PRODUCTS FROM SHELVES
>TO PUBLICLY ANNOUNCE NAMES OF COMPANIES INVOLVED WITHOUT WAITING FOR A COMPANY TO VOLUNTARILY RECALL PRODUCTS
>TO PROMPTLY SHUT DOWN PLANTS PRODUCING THE ITEM(S)
>REVEAL COMPANY NAMES IN THE ENTIRE SUPPLY CHAIN OF THE AFFECTED FOOD/INGREDIENT
FDA Recall Policies
http://www.cfsan.fda.gov/~lrd/recall2.html
The Federal Food, Drug, and Cosmetic Act, (the law) does not generally authorize FDA to “order” a manufacturer to recall a food, cosmetic or supplement. The agency may request a product recall if the firm is not willing to remove dangerous products from the market without FDA’s written request. Only when a medical device, human tissue products, and infant formula pose a risk to human health; that the law specifically authorizes FDA to prescribe a recall and to rule on the scope and extent of the same*.
The manufacturers or distributors of the product carry out most recalls of products regulated by FDA voluntarily. In some instances, a company discovers that one of its products is defective and recalls it entirely on its own. In others, FDA informs a company of findings that one of its products is defective and suggests or requests a recall. Usually, the company will comply.
*************
The guidelines categorize all recalls into one of three classes according to the level of hazard involved.
Class I recalls are for dangerous or defective products that predictably could cause serious health problems or death. Examples of products that could fall into this category are a food found to contain botulinal toxin, food with undeclared allergens, a label mix-up on a life saving drug, or a defective artificial heart valve.
Class II recalls are for products that might cause a temporary health problem, or pose only a slight threat of a serious nature. One example is a drug that is under-strength but that is not used to treat life-threatening situations.
Class III recalls are for products that are unlikely to cause any adverse health reaction, but that violate FDA labeling or manufacturing regulations. Examples might be a container defect (plastic material delaminating or a lid that does not seal); off-taste, color, or leaks in a bottled drink, and lack of English labeling in a retail food.
Comment by petlover — April 24, 2007 @ 7:37 am
Well, I’m glad they are talking to people who have been hurt by salmonella poisoning, but it would have been really nice to have heard from someone who lost their pet, too.
Comment by Elderta — April 24, 2007 @ 7:40 am
Dang have to leave. What I meant in earlier comment is will we be able to hear a replay of this later perhaps on itchmo?
Comment by VJ — April 24, 2007 @ 7:40 am
Time for a BOSTON TEA PARTY, friends.
I don’t want any more Chinese ingredients, period. A few tons of glutinous muck dumped on the capital steps might make the news.
Comment by 4lgdfriend — April 24, 2007 @ 7:41 am
“Mr. Barton of Texas:
Says there is a long history of contamination in China. Cited 1998 investigation - 155 US citizens sickened by a Chinese antibiotic. Counterfeit animal drugs. Numerous discrepancies.”
Counterfeit animal drugs?!!!
Wow. That is so wrong on so many levels. =:-O
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 7:41 am
Christie:
How about a donut to go with that IV? Thanks for keeping us up to date. Don’t know where pet owners would be without all of you…..I’d still be feeding one of the dry foods that I’m hearing so much about & probably would no longer have my sweet little baby girl.
I hope & pray that something comes out about not only the two companies still holding out info about the FIRST shipment of rpc but where the SECOND shipment went…..whether we have more in pet foods or on our dinner tables. Mighty scary.
Keep up the good work!
Comment by Jan — April 24, 2007 @ 7:42 am
Christie:
Thank you, Thank you for doing this for us.
Katie
Comment by Katie — April 24, 2007 @ 7:50 am
I hope they’re putting Mrs. Sally Qing Miller under oath. She was certified to inspect IN CHINA. I want to hear her testify under oath.
“American” companies are responsible and accountable. They’re the ones we paid.
But beyond that, there are no American companies anymore. Business is morally responsible to nothing but profit from wherever it can be had and a co. that does business in the US does so only as a front.
Comment by 4lgdfriend — April 24, 2007 @ 7:55 am
John Dingle (D) MI (ex officio) - believe he’s head of Energy & Commerce Committee
Chair of O&I Subcommittee Bart Stupak (D) MI
Vice Chair of O&I Subc Charlie Melancon (D) LA
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 7:59 am
The panel up next are pet owners.
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 7:59 am
Comment by 4lgdfriend — April 24, 2007 @ 7:55 am
I don’t believe anyone is under oath. Although they should be.
Comment by Steve — April 24, 2007 @ 8:01 am
wondering if each marcher in the 4/28 protest might want to carry 4 lbs of wheat gluten, a quart of water, and some red dye along?? better yet, cement fixative. That’s what the tainted gluten did in our pets kidneys. leave a bloody trail.
Comment by 4lgdfriend — April 24, 2007 @ 8:02 am
yes, they put them under oath
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 8:03 am
Marry Ann: yes, they put them under oath
I don’t think so. If you remember Sen Byrd asked for the head of the FDA to be put under oath. No one else was. This isn’t a trial, but a hearing. I don’t know if they can ask anyone not a govt employee to testify to a hearing under oath.
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 8:10 am
thanks for following this.
FDA has the rules in place, but when the FDA workers find violations, nothing happens. I think the examples of peanut butter and spinach speak to that - I read the article elsewhere that discussed the GA plant that has repeated violations on the peanut butter thing. Same for the spinach, ie they are repeat domestic offenders, that given what I see, will continue to do so. Considering the volume of imports and the existing domestic issues, it doesn’t look like there is any possible way to ever have the manpower to check everything coming in.
So if we quit buying from sellers who misbehave like China, for example, and then enforced our existing laws (which I imagine are NOT being enforced because of power plays, greed, trade agreements and the like pre-empting our need to protect our food supply), then we eliminate a big part of our problems. Criminal prosecutions wouldn’t be a bad idea either.
Comment by TC — April 24, 2007 @ 8:11 am
Re: testifying under oath
The food industry’s “honor system” doesn’t seem to be working too well so far, hopefully the hearing testimony will fare better.
Comment by slt — April 24, 2007 @ 8:12 am
TC: So if we quit buying from sellers who misbehave like China, for example, and then enforced our existing laws…
Boston Tea party.
WHAT existing laws????
Comment by 4lgdfriend — April 24, 2007 @ 8:14 am
Anyone know the name of the rep from Michigan on this committee? I can’t read it.
Comment by Christie Keith — April 24, 2007 @ 8:15 am
Bart Stupak is the subcommitteechair
John Dingell is the committee chair
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 8:17 am
Oh, in case that wasn’t clear, they’re both from MI
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 8:18 am
‘Rep. Burgess is an MD (obstetrician). Commented on the fact that feeding the contaminated peanut butter in the hospital is a nightmare.’
Yeah, same thing as was happening to sick dogs and cats except the toxic food they were being fed was their ONLY food and in some cases, had to be force fed.
Comment by slt — April 24, 2007 @ 8:19 am
Who is the one who just dismissed the panel? He is the one whose name I need… THANKS!
Comment by Christie Keith — April 24, 2007 @ 8:19 am
Christie, I’m not watching, but since STUPAK is the chair, he’s probably running the show. Hope your fingers hold up.
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 8:21 am
RE: Comment by 4lgdfriend — April 24, 2007 @ 7:55 am
Sally Qing Miller is a food engineer who has been certified as an ISO auditor. Int’l Standards Organizations audits and “blesses” manufacturer’s systems - this is NOT a governmental entity. It provides a means of verifying that a proposed ANSI standard has met certain requirements for due process, consensus, and other criteria by those developing the standard.
I don’t have information on exactly how people qualify to become an ISO auditor - limited info on that.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 8:22 am
Dingell is ex officio, like Byrd was ex officio, so doubt he’s running anything, though he can talk.
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 8:23 am
I sense major changes are coming - our pets will not have died in vain!!!
This testimony will NOT fall on deaf ears.
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 8:24 am
Re SALLY QING MILLER AND HER ISO CERTIFICATION:
http://www.iso.org/iso/en/abou.....index.html
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 8:24 am
I Just SAW This PANEL Put under OATH,+ the Last Speakers Were Also Put Under Oath
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 8:26 am
“A fine job of getting this information on their websites”????!!!
Comment by Kim — April 24, 2007 @ 8:27 am
Yes! Push that central veterinary early warning system!
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 8:28 am
Here they are all together if that helps you Christie:
John Dingle (D) MI (ex officio) - believe he’s head of Energy & Commerce Committee
Chair of O&I Subcommittee Bart Stupak (D) MI
Vice Chair of O&I Subc Charlie Melancon (D) LA
Gene Green (D) TX
Diane DeGette (D) CO
Mike Doyle (D) PA
Tim Murphy (R) PA
Joe Barton (R) TX (ex officio)
Henry Waxman (D) CA
Marsha Blackburn (R) TN
Ed Whitfield (R) KY Ranking Member
Greg Walden (R) OR
Jan Schakowsky (D) IL
Michael Burgess (R) TX
Jay Inslee (D) WA
Mike Ferguson (R) NJ
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 8:29 am
This guy gives me a bad feeling… glad he’s supporting the central organized reporting, but he’s clueless about the number of deaths. Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.
Comment by Kim — April 24, 2007 @ 8:30 am
Oh man… They’re saying that less than 1% of the animal deaths were caused by the contamination.
I hope someone takes them to task on this.
Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 8:30 am
Good one! Michigan and Oregon pet deaths and illnesses numbers were brought up, slamming the constantly reported false number of only 16 deaths!
Finally!
Comment by petlover — April 24, 2007 @ 8:31 am
“…statistics on the high side”????!!!! Oh man. Get rid of this guy. I just can’t stand it.
Comment by Kim — April 24, 2007 @ 8:32 am
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 8:26 am
Hey, good to know they actually were put under oath!
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 8:33 am
How do you quantify “safe”? They’re tap dancing all over the place. I think they [or at least I] want a method of measurement.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 8:34 am
common! whats up with this percentage? Why didn’t he answer this CLEARLY pointing out the numbers are through the roof?
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 8:35 am
Hopefully the weblog here is an RSS Feed??? You’re not typing are you? Or, do you have a steno/court reporter machine?
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 8:35 am
How could anyone speculate on the number of pet food deaths when the pet manufacturers denied at the onset that corn gluten, or rice protein concentrate was contaminated along with the wheat gluten.
My cat ate Hill’s Prescription Diet c/d and k/d, both wet and dry that conatined corn glueten and died on March 6th from kidney failure. He was subsequently cremated - where does he get counted in the stats?
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 8:36 am
Red Bank Veterinary Hospital _is_ a specialist hospital, although they also have (had? in 2003) a parallel general practice - one of my dogs was treated there for cancer, another for an eye problem - and the hospital has a good rep in the area. I don’t know Dr. DeCarlo, however.
Comment by Carol — April 24, 2007 @ 8:38 am
I really wish we had a vet epidemiologist or someone who could have given the REAL scope of these death. Damn.
Comment by spocko — April 24, 2007 @ 8:41 am
Dr. Anthony DeCarlo, Red Bank Veterinary Hospital:
“Having a central reporting agency could be the key factor in heading off similar problems in the future.”
WHOA.
Exsqueeze me? *Could be the key factor”?!
What smoke is this guy crackin’?!!!
Hello! A central reporting site for all the pet related deaths was needed weeks ago! This is why we only have 16 “official” deaths from the FDA.
*bangs head repeatedly HARD on desk*
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 8:43 am
Cathy, the ceo’s from MENU Foods + chem-nutra inc, they should by put under triple oath !!!!!!
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 8:43 am
USDA - Continuous presence by law
FDA - no continuous presence required
pepperoni pizza - regulated by USDA
cheese pizza - regulated by FDA
What’s wrong with this picture. It’s so wonder any of us are alive…maybe we ought to place the Homeland Security Agency in charge of our food supplies.
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 8:46 am
Ally: You said… *bangs head repeatedly HARD on desk*
Me too.
Comment by Kim — April 24, 2007 @ 8:49 am
Marry Ann,
“the ceo’s from MENU Foods + chem-nutra inc, they should by put under triple oath !!!!!!”
Why? So they can lie triple the amount?
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 8:49 am
Too much agency overlap and too many governmental hoops for the USG agencies to jump through before the information becomes public [if it does].
FDA has “equivalency agreements” with other countries exporting food to us [which involves chemicals illegal in the US, but not illegal in the exporting country]. WHOA! This is BAD.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 8:49 am
It’s irritating to hear a few of these Congressmen to ask questions which they do not know the answers….
CA determined the e.coli was from wild hogs in the area. Mr. Walden seemed surprised with her answer of wild animals.
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 8:52 am
I’m not really happy with this banfield guy
And this guy who asked about the spinach, what is his problem?
Comment by spocko — April 24, 2007 @ 8:55 am
Thinking about this vet who testified, Dr. DeCarlo, and his take on the number of pet deaths…One thing is that it doesn’t sound like he’s performed autopsies, so he’s just talking anecdotally. Nor has he said he’s been working with any FDA or other labs to assist in research on those pets his hospital treated or saw die that they thought might have eaten contaminated food. (Note: I just read that his hospital is one of the top 20 private animal hospitals in the country in terms of revenue. But it doesn’t sound like a teaching or research hospital like Animal Medical Center in NY.)
Has anyone reported an assessment of serious illnesses and death by state or region? It makes sense that manufacturing plants that the FDA knows were using contaminated ingredients would ship regionally. It could be that you ask a vet with a big practice in one area, like Dr. DeCarlo, about sick, dead pets and he will rightly answer that he hasn’t seen much, but in another region or state, the answer would be quite different.
Comment by Maureen — April 24, 2007 @ 8:56 am
How uproarious is it that Homeland Security is ALREADY involved in protecting our food supplies - incredibly effective, uh?
How unbelievable is this?
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 8:56 am
ecoli:
With migrant workers in the field, how far is the outhouse? a 1/4 mile? who is going to walk that far and back, when they could do it right there? pigs my eye. Another attempt to protect Mexico.
Comment by Gary — April 24, 2007 @ 8:57 am
Why is this guy here? He can’t answer ANY of these very good questions.
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 8:59 am
“DeCarlo - There is no question, he says, the vets need a single place to send this information.”
*ding-ding-DIIIIING!!!*
FINALLY he admits it.
There ya have it folks. The million dollar statement of the century.
Yegods.
Why did it take so long to admit it?
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 8:59 am
DeCarlo runs Red Bank, which in 2005 was the largest private practice in the country. Was an article in DVM mag - emailed to Christie
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 9:00 am
This is pathetic, a bunch of rehashed misinformation. I’m leaving for awhile - have to go give fluids to a friend’s cat. Thanks to Christie and the rest of you, I’ll read everything as soon as I get back. (I especially love the snarky comments, makes me feel less alone in my frustration.)
Comment by Kim — April 24, 2007 @ 9:00 am
Is he able to answer any questions?
I wonder if anyone is going to bring up the fact it’s not just melamine anymore.
Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 9:01 am
And not just wheat gluten. . .
Comment by Cardima — April 24, 2007 @ 9:02 am
Red Bank sounds like some location next to Shanghai or the the Yangtze River.
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 9:02 am
I thought we were supposed to be hearing from people who had lost their pets? I guess I didn’t realize we were going to hear from people affected by the various other contaminations out there.
Comment by Adrienne — April 24, 2007 @ 9:03 am
Comment by Kim — April 24, 2007 @ 9:00 am
(I especially love the snarky comments, makes me feel less alone in my frustration.)
I’m with you, Kim. Some days snarky is all that gets me through the anxiety of watching this fiasco unfold. You are definitely not alone.
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 9:03 am
where is the pet parent?
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:04 am
O please. I think *I* might be able to offer better testimony than Dr. DeCarlo, just from following the news/forums/etc.
Comment by slt — April 24, 2007 @ 9:08 am
Red Bank sounds like some location next to Shanghai or the the Yangtze River.
Actually Don, it’s in NJ. They probably chose him because it’s the largest private practice in the country. BUT, the east coast didn’t get as many poisonings as did other parts of the country.
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 9:08 am
how about the fact that it was reported in the media after the Menu recall that the CDC learned of a possible melamine contamination in our HUMAN food supply (before the pig incident) Then in response to that, they quietly contacted hospitals requesting that they be informed immediately of any increase in people presenting in the ER’s with renal problems INSTEAD of letting us know that there was a suspect product lurking on our shelves. ARGGGH
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:10 am
We’re up!
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:12 am
AH - they have lawyers…..
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:12 am
By the way, if it matters, Walden (R-OR) and Whitfield (R-KY, ranking minority member) both receive major chunks of their campaign funds from agribusiness PACs (yes that includes food producers).
Oooh, he’s putting the industry guys under oath - Miller has counsel!! :)
Comment by Laura — April 24, 2007 @ 9:12 am
Thank you so much Christie!
Comment by Donna — April 24, 2007 @ 9:12 am
Laura - great info - thanks!
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:13 am
Henderson and Miller have counsel present with them.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:13 am
They have counsil….I.E. Lawyers with them. :)
I love it… How appropriate that they guy’s name is sweat.
Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 9:13 am
oooh boy! now it’s gonna get juicy!
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 9:13 am
Here we go folks!
Comment by Lois C. — April 24, 2007 @ 9:14 am
i wonder how many menu foods pet owners were affected by pet deaths?
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:15 am
Lalalalalalalalalalala!
Comment by Lois C. — April 24, 2007 @ 9:15 am
Sigh, I guess not one bloody congressperson has read FERP. We already have a plan for food emergency response. BUT it involves each state getting it’s act together to respond to these issues - communication largely and cash from our federal guv’mint. It is the reason why MI had numbers, because in 2004 they set up an emergency vet reponse network.
It needs to be implemented. We do not need to reinvent the wheel. Over the last couple of years every danged agency has asked for stuff they need for this issue - more and improved tests for adulterants, more labs, reporting networks, state response.
Sounds like DeCarlo doesn’t know about it either. Will anyone today say FERP? Any aides out there trolling? Look it up…..please, for doGs sake. It’s pitiful an average citizen is more up to date on this stuff than our representatives in congress.
Comment by CathyA — April 24, 2007 @ 9:17 am
Appropriate actions of selling stock prior to the recall?
Comment by Cardima — April 24, 2007 @ 9:17 am
What a crock of crap this guy is trying to feed us. Jeez. This guy is a sleaze ball and I am putting it nicely.
He is accepting no responsibility at all as to why Menu didn’t check the shipments. Disgusting, disgusting!!
Comment by Adrienne — April 24, 2007 @ 9:18 am
How can he say this - there is no evidence of this yet - and china is denying involvement.
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:18 am
You watch - this is going to be Henderson and Miller pointing at China - just a dog and pony show for them to absolve themselves of responsibility.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:19 am
well that was a big fat lie ,he waited 3 weeks before this was made public
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 9:19 am
He is trying to save his butt!
Comment by Lois C. — April 24, 2007 @ 9:19 am
As in Menu stock that it. . . As in the timeline Steve keeps posting. . .
Comment by Cardima — April 24, 2007 @ 9:20 am
Henderson—Not my fault! Nothing we could have done! Give me a break…You could have told everyone as soon as your feeding trial animals started getting sick. Ok House Reps, ask this guy the tough questions Please.
Comment by Shawn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:22 am
MORE LIES!!!!!
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:23 am
Here’s some food for thought. When the spinach incident happened, almost all fresh cut spinach was removed from shelves.
Yet to this day we have pet foods that are sold containing all 3 ingredients that are known to have been contaminated. On top of that, the ingredients have been sourced from China, but they’re still on the shelf.
Shameful.
Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 9:23 am
Yup, Henderson lied.
Comment by Lil Bear's Momma — April 24, 2007 @ 9:23 am
All this testimony the Menu guy is giving under oath - can’t he face perjury charges if it is proven to be knowingly false testimony?
Comment by slt — April 24, 2007 @ 9:24 am
slt - i would LOVE to see that happen. These fabrications are horrendous.
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:25 am
How about the HOLES IN YOUR CEILINGS?? FIXING THOSE WOULD HAVE BEEN CHEAPER!!!
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 9:28 am
blah blah blah….money money money….not more than the lawsuits though…..
Comment by kelli — April 24, 2007 @ 9:28 am
I hope, I hope, I hope that someone hits Henderson on the head on the 3 week notification lag. Bet they’re going to try to get off because they’re a Canadian company and therefore not under the same laws as the US with respect to the FDA.
Oh bull - ConAgra is spending all this money - like that is supposed to convince me that it automatically equates to safety? Oh puh-leeze! An airhead I am not.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:29 am
gee thanks buddy.
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:29 am
Con Agra guy double speak. All that money to fix their leaking roof…..duh. which they were fined over back in 2005.
Oh, now the Chem Nutra guy…..this out to be good……
Comment by Lil Bear's Momma — April 24, 2007 @ 9:30 am
Miller’s nervous - and rightfully so.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:30 am
It’s pretty obvious that Mr. Miller is reading his attorney’s scripted testimony for the first time.
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 9:31 am
OOOOOHHHHH!!!!! Chem-Nutra just threw Menu under the bus!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
HE brought up the 3 week lag!
Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 9:31 am
THEY ARE DENYING INVOLVEMENT!!!!
What do you mean they didnt respond?????
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:32 am
Thanks for the note about the pet owners. I missed that. Had to go to a meeting.
Comment by Elderta — April 24, 2007 @ 9:33 am
She should be the one up there:
http://www.chemnutra.com/pricipals.htm
Sally Miller, President
Sally has over 12 years of experience in China as QA Manager and Purchasing Manager, working for various multinational companies. She was responsible for purchasing large quantities of nutritional and food ingredients in China for export worldwide.
Sally earned an MBA as well as an Engineering degree in Food Engineering. She has been a member of the Institute for Supply Management in the US. She has also been certified in China as an ISO 9000 Chief Auditor.
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 9:33 am
china - i am referring to….
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:33 am
When Menu Foods delayed the recall for three weeks after they knew their food was toxic and killing pets, this changed from an accidental adulteration and poisoning of the food to over four thousands counts of animal cruelty.
We have laws at the state level to prosecute this conduct. Folks need to complain to their states atty office and to their senators to insist that these criminals are prosecuted. This is action folks can take now.
CEO’s and CFO’s would act a bit better if their freedom was on the line. You can bet the two other companies making toxic treats out of toxic rice gluten would have acted by now if prosecution had begun.
Comment by Larry — April 24, 2007 @ 9:35 am
>>Dave Colo of ConAgra begins.
>>says Once more said how sorry they are… “truly sorry”… for the people who might have been harmed. His voice is trembling a little.
Yeah, right.
I’m sure his attorney instructed him to use those theatrics.
It’s a known tactic.
*rolls eyes*
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 9:35 am
I have not gotten to listen to much of this, have we established anything?
Comment by Carole — April 24, 2007 @ 9:35 am
well said - and agreed, Larry….
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:36 am
What about the missing codes/batche numbers:
http://www.chemnutra.com/pr.pdf
DISPOSAL??? THAT IS ONE BIG CONCERN OF MINE! I’M WRITING TO EVERYONE I CAN ABOUT THIS TOPIC.
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 9:36 am
Am I missing something? Menu and 3 others. Do we know who all of the others are?
Comment by Cardima — April 24, 2007 @ 9:36 am
What does “basically quarantined” mean? [Re statement by Miller regarding the where the remainin wheat gluten is.] The word “basically” troubles me. It’s a caveat - someone should follow up on that.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:37 am
AND instant mashed potatoes, baked goods etc….
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:38 am
Colo is the sr. vp of manufacturing for ConAgra but says he doesn’t keep track of All the FDA requests. Odd.
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 9:39 am
I AM CONFUSED….didn’t he just say they used this product - then said it was a new product for them?
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:40 am
Heck, give ‘em all 60 mins each!
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 9:40 am
Hows this hearing going?
The PFI guys start stabbing each other in the back yet?
Comment by Steve — April 24, 2007 @ 9:41 am
Who was it that recommended XY company to NutraChem, I wonder?
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:42 am
RE Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:40 am
Miller’s withholding.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:43 am
Who were the other pet food companies that got the poison, what kind of investigation would VERY carefully NOT ask where the rest of the poison went?
Comment by E. Hamilton — April 24, 2007 @ 9:44 am
“Basically quarantined” means mostly, meaning not all.
Comment by Larry — April 24, 2007 @ 9:44 am
So far I’m not impressed with the knowledge of those asking the questions.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:44 am
I hope someone on the committee puts the heat on these guys. I’ve got to leave for a dr appt. Anyone with a prayer to spare ask for the dr to agree to a trial of enbrel or humira. Thanks a million Chistie.
Comment by Cardima — April 24, 2007 @ 9:46 am
Here are 3 archived ConAgra Warning Letters:
http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/.....rchive.cfm
he lied…
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 9:46 am
Gut feeling: This Miller guy with ChemNutro is nothing but a stooge. He’s not bright enough to run a lemonade stand, never mind a “multimillion dollar” international trading company. Who shoved him out there in front, & who’s REALLY behind ChemNutro? The alleged wife, perhaps? Some unnamed character(s) at home or abroad? Someone is running this clever fraud where Chinese contaminants are foisted on an unsuspecting public — and it ain’t Mr.Miller.
Comment by Dee — April 24, 2007 @ 9:48 am
Neither am I, Lynn. They should prepare themselves better. A few are pretty savvy…
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 9:50 am
Don’t forget. Chem-nutra is not the only importer at fault either. Wilbur-Ellis and another un-named company imported contaminated rice protein concentrate.
This miller guy is just a clueless homer who imports stuff from people his wife knows.
Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 9:53 am
I am a member of The National Registry of Food Safety Professionals, and hold National Certification in Food Safety.
This is a complete show by these people and their lawyers.
Bring on the Dancing Bears!
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:55 am
Miller with ChemNutra was a VP with the now defunct EF Hutton. Does that ring a few bells?
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 9:55 am
“This miller guy is just a clueless homer who imports stuff from people his wife knows.”
Yeah, probably his wife’s ex-husband who runs a melamine plant next to her wheat gluten factory.
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 9:56 am
Appreciate the super efforts so much from Pet connection.
Glad to hear that they will be looking at other countries systems too. Still flabbergasted why Europe has no pet food recalls , although the same biggie brands, recalled in USA/Canada( Iams,Eukanuba,Royal Canin, Hills etc) but made in their European plants etc, are apparently problem free. So what is different in those manufacturing plants???. Wish they invited a representative from the EU to their hearings. There are plenty of them stationed in DC area.
Comment by Serijna — April 24, 2007 @ 9:58 am
There’s THAT word — proprietary
The definition to me: ain’t none of your business, just buy our products & TRUST US!
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 9:58 am
Was someone instructed by a superior at the FDA not to put their request in writing to ConAgra - perhaps pressured by ConAgra’s counsel giving ConAgra time to destroy the peanut butter?
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 10:02 am
RE: Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 9:53 am
I disagree about Miller. I think he does a good job of presenting himself that way - but I’ll bet there’s a lot of covert strategic planning between Sally and Steve. Somewhere someone is going to find, I’ll bet, that Sally has some real financial gain in China on the basis of the exports to the US [and wherever else they ship].
Too bad the US does not have the authority to get XY’s customer records to see who else they shipped products to.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 10:02 am
BEIJING, April 24 (Xinhua) — Chinese President Hu Jintao urged Party and government officials to ensure that farm produce is safe and strict agricultural standards are enforced at a meeting on Tuesday.
Hu Jintao, who is also general secretary of the Communist Party of China (CPC) Central Committee, said quality control of farm produce all the way from field and barn to consumers’ tables is vitally necessary.
After listening to lectures by two experts on agriculture and food science, Hu called for better monitoring of environmental conditions in major farm producing areas.
China must produce more chemical-free produce and green food, Hu said, noting that farmers should be taught to use fertilizers more cautiously and scientifically.
Comment by Steve — April 24, 2007 @ 10:05 am
RE: Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 9:56 am
Who is Sally’s ex-husband?
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 10:06 am
Lynn, I agree. Why else would Miller indicate they “never considered recourse” against the company?!?
Mary
Comment by Brooklyn Stargazer — April 24, 2007 @ 10:06 am
“our levels were so low…we couldn’t detect it” - BULL SH*T!!!!
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:06 am
right…..If I do anymore eye rolls I will give myself a concussion. Maybe I could blame it on imported rice protein concentrate.
Comment by Joyce — April 24, 2007 @ 10:07 am
I am looking at my jar of recalled Peter Pan, ConAgra - think if I had it independently tested they could find the “low levels”?
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:08 am
BS: ‘Asking about Miller’s wife who is president of ChemNutra and is from China… since his wife is a citizen of China, they might have additional recourse. Miller says he has not looked into that, but will.’ HOW ABOUT IF WE HAVE RECOURSE TO PUT HER IN JAIL HERE? WE’LL LOOK INTO THAT THEN……
‘I am a member of The National Registry of Food Safety Professionals, and hold National Certification in Food Safety.
This is a complete show by these people and their lawyers. Bring on the Dancing Bears!
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 9:55 am
EXACTLY. DO YOU HAPPEN TO KNOW SALLY QING MILLER? ALSO A MEMBER HOLDING SAID CERTIFICATION.
E.F. Hutton ring a bell? YES, as in Barabara Bush, as in LIARS.
Comment by 4lgdfriend — April 24, 2007 @ 10:09 am
RE: Comment by Steve — April 24, 2007 @ 10:05 am
Steve:
“Hu said, noting that farmers should be taught to use fertilizers more cautiously and scientifically”
~ MORE CAUTIOUSLY? Since when did they ever exercise caution? They’ve got one of the highest contamination rates world wide. Their hospitals are continuously congested with food poisoning.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 10:09 am
We SHOULD HAVE BEEN INSPECTING THOSE MFRS ALREADY!! Git’er done!!
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 10:12 am
IE: FOREIGN MANUFACTURERS
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 10:13 am
AARRGGGH!
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:15 am
>>Whitfield asks Henderson about finished product testing program at Menu…assumes it would not detect melamine.
“Program at Menu…is the testing of the raw materials, rather than testing finished product. ***Cooking is supposed to deal with bacterial contamination***.”
Then why do sites such as Little Foxes (http://www.thelittlefoxes.net/html/pet_food.html), report under their article’s listing of “how pet food is made” that:
“Although the cooking process may kill bacteria in pet food, the final product can lose its sterility during the subsequent drying, fat coating, and packaging process.”
AND on Little Big Cat (http://tinyurl.com/2hrc8a):
“Caution: adding water or milk to dry food does not solve the problem; and the fact that there are always bacteria on the surface of dry food means that adding moisture can result in massive bacterial growth—and a very upset tummy”
There are other sites listing this information as well. The list is endless.
ARRRGH.
The mind boggles.
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 10:15 am
Lynn,
I have no idea who Sally’s ex-husband is - or if she even has one - it was a tongue in cheek comment. By the time this mess is all over, Steve might become her ex! Who knows?
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 10:15 am
Well, so far the only thing that’s positive about this morning’s session is that it’s bringing some attention [not much] to pet food recall.
Maybe better restructuring of federal organizations will happen somewhere down the road. Somehow I see years of head scratching before that happens. Look at FEMA. Notice any changes?
This is strictly a “he said, she said” hearing.
My preference is not to give lip service, but to proactively get answers and make changes now. This business of putting on dog and pony shows that really don’t say a lot is a waste of time.
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 10:16 am
It does not matter what the problem was…get it off the shelf, THEN decide what to do.
Comment by kelli — April 24, 2007 @ 10:16 am
GO GO GO….DON’T STOP!
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:17 am
OK, maybe now we’re getting down to business [discussing the length of the recall…Menu foods].
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 10:18 am
Gosh, we’re supposed to keep this on the civil level and not refer to anyone as sn*rky or sl*m* or less than *nt*ll*g*nt but oh bite my tongue! ‘Cause if they aren’t st*p*d they are sure cr**k*d and we all can see it. Golly gosh darn it this is all so bl**dy educational.
Comment by Nancy Nielsen — April 24, 2007 @ 10:19 am
And just when they finally start getting somewhere, they relent.
/bangsheadondesk
Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 10:20 am
More info about DeCarlo, one of the RBVH founders.
http://www.rbvh.net/services/neurology/decarlo.htm
I had to have my dog treated at this specialist hospital due to an incompetent Bedminster, NJ vet. Some of the emergency interns who treated him were very competent, but this place seemed like an expensive teaching hospital to me.
I noticed that not one of the five vets who treated my dog last April/May are no longer there. The place was an organized zoo, but I can’t imagine the vets having time to surf the internet to report pet statistics.
Comment by Steph — April 24, 2007 @ 10:20 am
Let’s hope they question the insider trading.
Comment by Larry — April 24, 2007 @ 10:21 am
The credentials for the “President” wife and “CEO” husband are highly suspect. My bet is this is a man and wife who wheel and deal by the internet or phone eluding all consequences of shady business practices.
Comment by Steve — April 24, 2007 @ 10:21 am
Of all of the “suits”, the spinach guy seems to be the most open & informational.
Comment by Justin — April 24, 2007 @ 10:22 am
Stupak just NAILED Henderson—-asked if he didn’t want to change his answer re: doing the recall differently, then pointed out their recall took almost a month and cut him off!!!! Fire up the lawyers!
Comment by Nancy — April 24, 2007 @ 10:23 am
Wish they would of asked Menu foods why he sold most of his stocks before recall was made public!!!!!
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 10:23 am
They’re talking about e coli in CA in the growers’ fields. I wonder…..where do they get fertilizer from? China? [I don’t know.]
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 10:25 am
i thought it was human grade….
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:26 am
“The credentials for the “President” wife and “CEO” husband are highly suspect. My bet is this is a man and wife who wheel and deal by the internet or phone eluding all consequences of shady business practices.”
On the mark as usual Steve!! I agree.
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 10:29 am
ok- I have been watching this for an hour… who are the other 3 companies?????? Why will they not say????
Comment by Sandi Schreiber — April 24, 2007 @ 10:29 am
Yes, why do we import wheat gluten! Finally a good question!
Comment by Lois C. — April 24, 2007 @ 10:30 am
Is it Henderson who sold his stock? I wonder if they are going to bring insider trading charges. If they put Martha in jail, this slimeball ought to do time.
Comment by Joyce — April 24, 2007 @ 10:30 am
Yes, where ARE we in prosecuting, not only the foreign suppliers of the glutens, but the importers here in the U.S. and every pet food brand that used the ingedients?
Comment by petlover — April 24, 2007 @ 10:31 am
Make them eat the food they make.
(pulling my hair out here…)
Comment by Kim — April 24, 2007 @ 10:33 am
again with this!!!???
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:33 am
Is it Henderson who sold his stock? I wonder if they are going to bring insider trading charges. If they put Martha in jail, this slimeball ought to do time.
Comment by Joyce — April 24, 2007 @ 10:30 am
*********************
Mark Wiens, Chief Financial Officer of Menu Foods.
Comment by petlover — April 24, 2007 @ 10:33 am
answer it buddy…
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:33 am
Good hard-hitting questions now.
They grow in the “right climate, right pH”. Will need to look at Salmonella needs.
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 10:34 am
Re ChemNutra’s Sally and Steve:
Sure, they wheel and deal by phone - their small Las Vegas office is closed and locked.Are you kidding?
These people, I’ll bet, are highly sophisticated in dodging bullets. Uncomfortable at it, but so far they’ve dodged the bullets.
Wonder if the Millers import fertilizer from China?
Comment by Lynn — April 24, 2007 @ 10:35 am
What other pet food companies got the poison, geez, how hard is that to ask? Miller is sitting RIGHT THERE! Are they waiting for him to flit off to China and a second honeymoon with Sally? Where is Sally?
And where oh where did the rest of the poison go?!
Comment by E. Hamilton — April 24, 2007 @ 10:35 am
How can Colo be confident that it won’t happen again when he’s not sure of why it happened in the first place?
Comment by Don — April 24, 2007 @ 10:35 am
Joyce - that would be Mark Wiens, Menu’s CFO
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:36 am
Insider trading story; Menu Foods CFO
http://tinyurl.com/3azkmb
Comment by Larry — April 24, 2007 @ 10:36 am
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:33 am
“answer it buddy…”
Obviously he can’t.
Not without indicting himself.
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 10:37 am
Joyce, yes,you are right it was Henderson who sold his stock. Martha did six month’s I think. this guy knew pets died from menu foods and sold i think 50% he should get LIFE in JAIL!!
Comment by MARRY ANN — April 24, 2007 @ 10:38 am
I clearly remember a news article that stated the CDC had concluded that the spinach contamination was thought to be run-off from wild hog that crossed the land.
Comment by Kat — April 24, 2007 @ 10:39 am
“Henderson says the FDA is trying to get into China. Says there is not much they (Menu) can do.”
Especially now that all the evidence has most likely been *poofed* into oblivion.
Gee, how convenient, eh?
Comment by Ally — April 24, 2007 @ 10:40 am
what happened to the pet parents that were supposed to testify?????
Comment by starr — April 24, 2007 @ 10:44 am
Re: Mark Wiens
The OSC is going to have to prove that Mark Wiens had inside information about the recall. Given that he also had a blackout period for selling his stock, this may not be a cut and dry legal case.
Someone will have to blow the whistle on him to show that he had the info, if in fact he did.
Comment by Carole — April 24, 2007 @ 10:44 am
DeCarlo says YES, from “what I can read on the medical side.” (NOTE: This isn’t correct. He says “the majority of the literature” is confident it’s melamine causing the symptoms. Again, that’s not correct. There is much talk “on the medical side” that melamine is likely a marker but not the actual cause.)
**************